How to Find a Job

How to Find a Job

00:00:00: Stephan Hanf: Welcome to How to Hochschuleour audio guide about tackling life and work at Rhine-Waal University of Applied Sciences, one of the most international universities in Germany. So grab a cup of iced coffee, put on your comfy headphones, and join us as we explore the world of Hochschule Rhein-Waal.

00:00:33: Jordan Freeman: We are at the tropical Greenhouse in at the University of Applied Science, Rhine-Waal, and we're gonna have a little tour about the greenhouse today. This is actually the biggest greenhouse in all of Germany out of all applied science universities. So the government put a lot of money into this, invested a lot of money.

00:00:53: Jordan Freeman: And here we have the ability of breeding and growing tropical plants in our tropical chamber, but we also have the opportunity around the greenhouse to grow domestic plants or plants that do not require a tropical climate to grow. So basically that's what we do. We have bees here as well. The university produces its own honey, but we're not allowed to sell it.

00:01:21: Jordan Freeman: We give it away to people that work here. And it's also home to a lot of student projects that people did before in the past years, and I'm sure for a lot of amazing projects to come. We can go this way. Yeah. Past the Mensa here. So on the left you see the, we call it like the living buffet, what we call here on the left. Berries,

00:01:48: Jordan Freeman: and we grew strawberries here. Over there we have some corn, and then in the left corner you will see pepper or chili, which was the plant of the year in 2022. Each year we pick a new plant of the year, and then we cultivate that several different varieties. We start in the chambers of the greenhouse where we can control the climate and the temperature and the rate of humidity.

00:02:16: Jordan Freeman: And once they're strong and healthy, we put 'em out right here in this living buffet garden that is also guarded. Fence, right? Because of rabbits. They also like our living buffet. Yeah. That's basically what we do here. We have all different kinds of varieties of plants that you can eat.

00:02:37: Stephan Hanf: Jordan

00:02:37: Stephan Hanf: Freeman is one of many SHKs, meaning Studentische Hilfskraft in English student assistants who work for the university, in his case, for the greenhouse.

00:02:47: Stephan Hanf: It is one of the jobs you can take on your time as a student here.

00:02:51: Jordan Freeman: We have student workers like me that work here and garden. We have our head gardener Herr Franz-Josef Kuhnigk, and sometimes also when professor Dr. Gebauer does his lectures. After that, he's notorious for giving you a tour of the garden and then you also are asked to remove some unwanted weeds here and there.

00:03:19: Jordan Freeman: Alright. That's how, that's usually how it goes. Yes. Alright, so. We have a lot of school classes coming here, especially from elementary school. Yeah. And they really enjoyed this part of the garden. Right? Because it's something that you can do and you can feel, you always see a lot of smiles on the faces of children when they're allowed to look at how bananas grow and all that type of fun stuff that you usually don't see

00:03:44: Jordan Freeman: 'cause I think nowadays, kids from my generation, they just, most of them walk into the grocery store and think the bananas just spawns in the grocery store, but they don't know how it works. Right? That is something that we have as a society, I think have to work for. So that we also managed to produce less food waste in order for us to respect it so that somebody knows, oh, into this banana, somebody put a lot of hours of work

00:04:12: Jordan Freeman: into it.

00:04:12: Stephan Hanf: Why isn't there something called a free lunch?

00:04:17: Dr. Zunera Rana: Well, uh, the idea behind that is that you don't get anything for free.

00:04:23: Stephan Hanf: Dr. Zunera Rana is a research associate at Rhine-Waal

00:04:27: Stephan Hanf: University.

00:04:27: Dr. Zunera Rana: You always have to have some sort of opportunity cost associated to it. Why? Because the resources are limited and the resources have to be divided between people or between things or between circumstances as well.

00:04:43: Stephan Hanf: In addition to her

00:04:43: Stephan Hanf: work at the Hochschule Rhein-Waal, Dr. Rana completed her PhD in development economics at Radboud University, the Netherlands, where she is now a lecturer.

00:04:51: Dr. Zunera Rana: If

00:04:52: Dr. Zunera Rana: even if you are having a free lunch, it means someone

00:04:54: Dr. Zunera Rana: else is paying for it and it's not really free in that sense. And for you, having that free lunch has an opportunity cost of some other sort.

00:05:05: Dr. Zunera Rana: So for example, you may might have gone to have that free lunch if I take this example. But in that timeframe, something you are missing, you go for your free lunch and let's say your work hours or your job, your work piles up or something. So that free lunch eventually has this opportunity cost that you are not able to work.

00:05:29: Dr. Zunera Rana: Or it could be that for that free lunch you are missing some friend's birthday party or something where you had to buy a gift or whatever. So you have an opportunity cost associated to it always. So it's never free in the freest sense, but there is always something that you would have to give up to get that free thing.

00:05:53: Stephan Hanf: Very well explained. And you said before that that was like the first idea that stuck with you, right?

00:06:00: Dr. Zunera Rana: Yes.

00:06:01: Dr. Zunera Rana: I really liked economics. So in school I had studied physics, chemistry, biology, and mathematics until my 10th grade. I liked chemistry and physics as well, but then I took one elective of economics.

00:06:17: Dr. Zunera Rana: And I realized that, yeah, this helps me understand my everyday life a lot better. The first sentence I remember that the teacher said was, there is no such thing as a free lunch. That was the first statement. And that's a very common statement used in economics. And I thought to myself, no, there is, you can ask a friend and you get your free lunch.

00:06:38: Dr. Zunera Rana: And then she started going into details of that, of how there are different resources and resources are limited. You have some opportunity costs, you give up this to get that, and so on and so forth. And I could relate to all of those things very easily in my everyday life

00:06:55: Dr. Zunera Rana: as well.

00:06:56: Jordan Freeman: We can here, there's some grapes here if you want to, you can just take one.

00:07:02: Jordan Freeman: Oh yeah. And try it. So what you will find is you tell me what you. What do you think? I'll get one too.

00:07:14: Stephan Hanf: They taste different.

00:07:15: Jordan Freeman: They taste

00:07:15: Jordan Freeman: much different.

00:07:16: Stephan Hanf: Yeah. So they're not so sweet, but they're, it's quite nice.

00:07:19: Jordan Freeman: So I think this one, we have two types of grapes here where we have the European grape and the American grape.

00:07:26: Jordan Freeman: This one all the way in the back there. Yeah. Of the garden is the European grape and this is the American grape. I always thought that. Mm. I always thought that the skin of these grapes here is much thicker.

00:07:43: Stephan Hanf: It is, yeah.

00:07:44: Jordan Freeman: Much thicker.

00:07:45: Stephan Hanf: I would agree. Yeah.

00:07:46: Jordan Freeman: But also nicer sweetness compared to the grapes that you buy in the grocery store.

00:07:52: Stephan Hanf: It's definitely different.

00:07:53: Jordan Freeman: But these are also a little smaller. I wish we would have enough grapes to produce our own wine, but so far I could not convince any of the staff here to, to produce our own wine. But maybe who comes, if there's anybody coming that knows a lot about wine, then I'm sure that we could do something about that.

00:08:13: Jordan Freeman: Right?

00:08:14: Stephan Hanf: Yeah.

00:08:15: Jordan Freeman: Here on the left we have our, we call it year round garden. In my second semester, last semester, there's a project for agribusiness students where they have to, they, we basically get this seed bed and we have to take care of it. We get a list of six plants that we have to grow in a group. So most groups are about three people big.

00:08:39: Jordan Freeman: Oh, that's it. And so, for example, I grew garlic, I had basil, I had potatoes, which turned out very nice. I had three different potatoes, and that was awesome. It was like, digging in dirt for Christmas presents like you were digging, and then, oh wait, there's more? There's more? And yeah, it actually was a very nice harvest with big potatoes, better than I thought it would be.

00:09:06: Stephan Hanf: But

00:09:06: Stephan Hanf: in this world of rapid change and global opportunities, finding the right job can be as challenging as it is exciting. That's why this month's episode, we are bringing in a range of experts to share their experiences, insights, and advice to help you find not just a job, but the one that truly matches your career goals and passions.

00:09:27: Stephan Hanf: We'll be exploring stories from our very own Hochschule Rhein-Waal community, people who have successfully walked this path and are eager to share their wisdom with you from expert advice to heartwarming stories. We hope that by the end of this episode, you'll feel more confident and ready to take the next big step in your career.

00:09:51: Stephan Hanf: Lesson number one, try to find

00:09:53: Stephan Hanf: out about yourself.

00:09:54: Imke Hans: I am basically the career service of the faculty of society and economics.

00:09:58: Stephan Hanf: One of the best

00:09:59: Stephan Hanf: experts on finding a job here at the university is Imke Hans.

00:10:03: Imke Hans: While other students may see

00:10:05: Imke Hans: me as well at university-wide things like for example, the scholarship event that we have, or do I wanna have a master or not?

00:10:12: Imke Hans: There are sometimes central events organized by the Student advisory Service that I also do something for, hold a lecture for something. But generally I'm working for the Faculty of Society in Economics, and I'm advising the students here on careers issues.

00:10:27: Stephan Hanf: Imke Hans is such an

00:10:29: Stephan Hanf: expert on a subject of finding a job because of a special moment that happened to her when she was just starting out on the job

00:10:36: Stephan Hanf: market.

00:10:36: Imke Hans: I knew I wanted to study, but I wasn't quite sure what to study, and I started off with German and Philosophy two subjects that have interested me the most. And realized, I think it was three weeks into my study, I realized that I would never finish the degree in philosophy. To me, it was a different type of philosophy than I was used to at school, and it was so theoretical and it required so much, I would say self-study rather than discussions that I already knew

00:11:05: Imke Hans: I was not gonna finish that. So I took a year to try out different other subjects and ended up with German and English because I love to read. I loved languages, I love the communication and is a university where, at least when I was there, a lot of students study to actually become teachers. So we are very few people just studying a subject related master.

00:11:25: Imke Hans: Most of us were studying to become teachers and it was actually very nice studying there. I have to say that I'm still a fan of that city, nice size, beautiful castle, a lot of things to do. So maybe it becomes obvious that I tried out many things other than studying as well, and the thought of what I was gonna do with it after my studies never even crossed my mind.

00:11:46: Imke Hans: I took up a position as a language teacher, and I did that for one and a half years, and then there was some issues. So all of us teachers, or most of us teachers left the position and I was hanging there and I needed to earn money pretty quickly. So the easiest job that I could get, or rather the ones that were searching the most, I wouldn't say it was an easy job, but the thing is they were searching so much that it was quite easy to get into a call center position.

00:12:15: Imke Hans: So I went around the corner, I actually had a test and had a trial, and I went into this huge hole where people were working for, I'm not gonna say the name, but for a huge telecommunication company. And their job was to sell telephone contracts and to call the people who just canceled their contract and make them a good offer.

00:12:36: Imke Hans: Something like this. And I went into this room and I was actually really happy I got rid of the other job, and I remember that this day I was so happy to find this job because it was so out of money turned into one of the worst days of my life. Honestly. There are different kinds, people from different university parties and I'd always assumed that they had made it.

00:12:56: Imke Hans: I didn't really care where I was gonna go, but I always thought, I know that they're safe. And they were sitting there and it was not just one or two people. There were like 15, 20 people sitting there that I'd studied with who were supposed to have had a job. And that to me was really, it was shocking and a waking up moment because I thought, I haven't studied for this long to then go to a call center.

00:13:21: Imke Hans: I mean, there's nothing wrong with the call center job. I don't mean that, but you don't study for years and back then it was at least four and a half years. You know, you don't try to do cool internships and to try yourself out in different jobs to go to a call center, which you could have done from the beginning onwards.

00:13:38: Imke Hans: I thought, well, this can't be my perspective. After all of those years of work and student life, this can't be the perspective I have sitting here in a call center. And that made me realize that you have to prepare for what you want to do afterwards. That is not a nice prospect, and to me it wasn't either.

00:13:54: Imke Hans: I stayed there for a couple of months and I learned a lot in this call center. I don't regret being there, but it was not a perspective for after my studies. Yeah.

00:14:04: Stephan Hanf: Did you talk

00:14:05: Stephan Hanf: with your former

00:14:06: Stephan Hanf: co-students?

00:14:07: Imke Hans: I did.

00:14:09: Stephan Hanf: What might have been the reason why you all ended up in, in this call center?

00:14:13: Imke Hans: The reason why they ended up not being in the job they wanted to were twofold.

00:14:19: Imke Hans: Some of them were teachers. They were studying to become teachers, and they had severe problems going through that teacher's training. So some of them were dropping out and trying for other ways. Some of them were dropping out and waiting to get to a different school maybe, or a different circle of people to get through the same training again.

00:14:41: Imke Hans: And others had just not found a job. They'd simply not found a different job. And one has to say that the university at that point of time, I'm not sure how it is today, but at that point of time, didn't offer any services with regards to careers at all. On the contrary, I would say that all of the professors who, it's understandable because most of the professors in the German university system, and I'm not talking about universities of applied sciences, I'm talking about normal universities or full universities and I don't quite know how to call them in English.

00:15:14: Imke Hans: They have gone through the university system and they have stayed within the system because they need to graduate and they need to write their PhD, they need to write a habitation, teach, and become a professor. So they've never left the university. And I think most of the teachers or professors that we had, they were really convinced that they were educating students to become university professors.

00:15:38: Imke Hans: Now, logic dictates that this is not possible. I don't even know. We had maybe, I don't know, let's say we had 10 professors and every year we were like 70 students. So we're not all becoming teachers or professors. It, that's impossible. And don't, I'm not sure that's was the correct ratio, but I don't think anyone ever thought of that.

00:15:58: Imke Hans: And I honestly also think that certain perspectives as I did not belong to literary science, for example, I don't wanna say they were kept from us, but it was something that was not drawn into the concept of teaching. So while we were looking at different perspectives on how to analyze literature, There was nothing ever that had to do with business administration or with how to use knowledge.

00:16:26: Imke Hans: It was more of the complete development of your personality and knowledge with regards to the subject. But that sort of negated that There is a perspective out there that will also ask you after your studies, so what are you good at? How, what can you use it for? How can I use you as an employee? And as there was no career, service or anything else, that question was never asked.

00:16:52: Imke Hans: And I could have asked my question myself, but I don't think any of us really did. So then you've got a fully developed personality and you know a lot about your subjects and then you get your graduation certificate and then there comes nothing. Um, there was still the generation where there came a lot of internships, but

00:17:15: Imke Hans: after that, it was very, very difficult for a lot of the people to actually get into a job very difficult because they didn't know how to sell themselves. Meaning how to tell people what their strengths are, how they can use them, these strengths and what they can use them for. So they didn't know how to communicate that.

00:17:36: Imke Hans: They sometimes even didn't know themselves. And without that knowledge, it is very difficult to get into a position because you need to be able to explain to somebody else why they should hire you and not the, I don't know how many other million people out there who would like to be hired. If you can't do that, it's gonna be very difficult.

00:17:54: Imke Hans: And it was even more difficult back then because the job market was a bit more difficult as well. And that's how they ended up in a call center. It was a good option to earn money, maybe to earn money for a year or two and some stayed.

00:18:05: Stephan Hanf: And how did this experience fit in to what you're doing right now here in Rhine-Waal?

00:18:11: Imke Hans: It fit in actually in, in many fold ways now as I am a careers consultant and I try to help people to do exactly that, to bring in the perspective of what do I want to do afterwards? All the students today are much more aware that there is a world outside. Maybe it's because we're at a University of Applied Sciences where people generally have had work experience when they become professors.

00:18:33: Imke Hans: That might be the case. But generally, I think students are a lot more aware still. Uh, they're not always aware of what their strengths are, but they can actually do with their position or rather that, honestly speaking very often, I don't think that's the question. The question's, what do I want to do with what I've got?

00:18:50: Imke Hans: And a lot of students don't dare to ask that question. And it's sometimes a long and not that easy process to find out, this is what I'm trying to help with because I think I don't want our students to. You may not have the dream position after your studies, but I don't want anyone to feel like they're not useful or they don't have a place, or they need to take any job just because they need a job.

00:19:17: Imke Hans: That's not the case. We have really well educated students here and I want them to see their strength and I want them to be able to tell other people where they want to go. And this may sound tacky, but to dare to dream, and this is really important, just develop your goals. And it's not about necessarily getting a career where you're going upwards, where the end is gonna be the CEO of an organization, but career to me is a life decisions that we make.

00:19:45: Imke Hans: So it can be upwards, if you wanna call that upwards, downwards, if you want to call that downwards, it can be to the left, to the right. You can stop your current career and I don't know, try to produce cheese. So it's about the decisions we make on how we spend our life and how we can actually finance our life.

00:20:02: Imke Hans: It doesn't have to be, I don't know, a suit, a tie, and a higher salary every single year. It is your own decision. But in order to make that decision, you need to dare to dream. You need to be able to think about what you actually want, to be honest to yourself and to find out what you can do. So I think this is one of my most important goals as a careers consultant to help in that case.

00:20:27: Imke Hans: And yeah, I don't want anyone to have that feeling that I had when I went into this room. It was a feeling of doom, honestly speaking. And at the same time, the other thing that I learned of that, how that influenced my career is communication skills. So how can you communicate with people? It's little tricks as well on the phone.

00:20:50: Imke Hans: It is how your body posture influences your voice. So there are so many things I learned during those couple of months that I wouldn't miss them for the world. And that's another thing. You have so many different stations in your life. You try out so many different things and you take something from all of them.

00:21:07: Imke Hans: So being aware of what it is that you take from these different experiences and that you bring with you and you carry with you and something extremely valuable, but sometimes it needs someone to help you sharpen your view on what kind of skills you bring because there's so many out there and you automatically gain so many through different stations, whether it's student initiatives, whether it's part-time jobs, student jobs, even the jobs you hate.

00:21:31: Imke Hans: If you hate them and you stick with them for a while, it shows so much determination and pulling through something like that. So students who finance their studies on their own, Through night shifts and everything, how much strength can you have and how much determination, how much do you want to study in order to do that?

00:21:46: Imke Hans: So it's my highest respect for that, but sometimes they're not able to see that themselves. And then it needs someone to, yeah, as I said, to sharpen their view on the skills they actually bring.

00:21:57: Stephan Hanf: What is it, what I could do as student doing my studies to avoid this situation, to don't get into this position, to have this feeling of doom.

00:22:07: Stephan Hanf: For example, if you finish your studies and you don't find a job, or you find a job and you know, and it's not what you actually studied for, like the call center story.

00:22:17: Imke Hans: I think knowledge is the most important thing, and it has to do with knowledge about the job market. But most of all, it has to do with knowledge about myself.

00:22:26: Imke Hans: I need to find out where my strengths are, where my passions are, what kind of goals I want to work for. It sounds tacky, but a lot of the students that I speak to, they do want to make a change in the world. And that may sound huge, but I, I always think that it doesn't have to be huge. I can empower people by giving them a different haircut, for example.

00:22:44: Imke Hans: And by empowering people, I will also make a change in the world. So it's about what kind of things do I want to contribute to and finding out what my strengths are and where my values are, and what the things are that I need to combine in my position to be someone who's happy or who can develop into the person I want to be.

00:23:03: Imke Hans: I need to collect information and I collect information throughout my studies. It's about finding out which subjects I like, and that's should be teacher unrelated. So what kind of subjects do I like? What kind of topics do I try to integrate into my papers, for example, so let's say I am studying political sciences and I'm really interested in a geographical area, and I've written, I don't know all of my papers on certain topics with regards to Southeast Asia, or I'm trying to fit a certain topic into every

00:23:33: Imke Hans: regional context or something. So it's about finding out what you really like, what you're interested in, but it's also about finding out what kind of skills you have and where you're good at. And you can have a look at things like, when do my friends actually ask me for help? When do they ask me for advice?

00:23:49: Imke Hans: In which fields do they ask me for advice? You can try yourself out when we've got so many countless initiatives at the university and over the last two years, it has become increasingly difficult to keep them alive. So we actually need students to join them. And it may be the Fair Trade Initiative, for example, or it may be UNICEF or it may be a part of AStA, the FSRs.

00:24:11: Imke Hans: And we have so many active students groups, and with all of these groups, you can implement your knowledge, you can be part of bigger thing, and you can find out what you really like. So do you really like event organization? Are you also good at event organization? Can you do it? Is it that you like the events themselves?

00:24:31: Imke Hans: Or is it really thinking through what kind of single steps do I need? Do I like to take the people with me? Or am I rather the person who would love to prepare a paper for Catcher on the Rhine, but I'd like to do it on my own rather than sharing it with other people? So going through life, basically through student life, and that includes all the jobs that we have as well, while we're students and collecting information about ourselves, about what we like, what we want to share with people, how we communicate, whether we like being close to people or whether we need certain areas that are responsibility of our own and not of others.

00:25:08: Imke Hans: So all of these types of information, they will then help you be knowledgeable when you leave the university and they will help you find out where you want to go. You first need to know where you are to then find out where you want to go, and that's both of those things you need before you can find out which route to take, whether it's another master's degree, whether it's the entry to a specific job, whether you want to do another internship.

00:25:33: Imke Hans: There are so many opportunities out there, but without knowing where you are, you cannot set the course for the rest. And I think that's what every single student can do. Imagine yourself having a suitcase and you just pack all of the experience and the skills and the things you like in there and carry them with you, because if you start thinking about that when you finish your studies, you're gonna have to do that under pressure very often, and that is not a good outset.

00:26:00: Imke Hans: So collecting the information on the way will make it a lot easier and explore. I mean, we've got so many, as I said, we've got like a world full of initiatives, internships, there's so many opportunities out there where you can try yourself out. So explore your skills. This is what every student can do.

00:26:17: Imke Hans: And, uh, I would use that. I've done it during my studies. I love trying out all of these different things there.

00:26:23: Stephan Hanf: I think

00:26:23: Stephan Hanf: a lot of students run into trouble because they study a certain thing. Maybe they, uh, write a certain thesis in the end and they go into the job market and have problems finding something that really fits to what they've done before.

00:26:39: Stephan Hanf: Mostly, I think you explained it quite well. It's not only about what you study, it's you should be more open-minded to other skills you might have that you develop during your studies besides your topics. But still, I think a lot of students struggle when they're finished that they figure out, oh, wait a minute, nobody needs my skillset or what I studied or my thesis.

00:27:01: Stephan Hanf: Nobody cares about

00:27:02: Stephan Hanf: it.

00:27:03: Imke Hans: It's always about the qualifications we gather on the side. It's also about our subjects, but there is no clear sort of profession at the end of these studies. And if you're looking for that, if you Google Jobs for International relations, for example, you probably won't get that far.

00:27:20: Imke Hans: However, and that's why I said you need information about yourself. If you know where you want to go, you can use totally different searches. You can find out what kind of organization, let's say Fair Trade, I'm working for the Fair Trade Initiative. And folks, we also need people for the Fair Trade Initiative.

00:27:35: Imke Hans: Just as a hint. And let's say you're interested in the area of fair trade, and that holds true for quite a few of our students in different degrees. So rather than looking for jobs for international relations or jobs for tourism, go for organizations that work with Fair Trade, that have a connection to that.

00:27:53: Imke Hans: There are a lot of subjects that you study that do not have a sub profession afterwards. And I think for once, it's about transferable skills. So even though it may be, I don't know, archeology or the history of Italian churches, you will still have learned certain things that you can apply in other fields that might be working with original sources.

00:28:16: Imke Hans: It might be literature research, it might be analyzing certain things, whether it's historical or political. These skills, there is something you can use in different contexts. So I think it's extremely important to find out what your transferable skills are, which skills you have learned that you can implement somewhere else.

00:28:36: Imke Hans: You know, I studied German languages, so yeah, let's face it, there's not gonna be that many job advertisements out there that looks specifically for someone with this degree, and there won't be too many job advertisements out there that look for someone who has specifically studied political sciences on a bachelor's level, international relations.

00:28:53: Imke Hans: But you still bring a lot of things to the table and finding out what these things are is really important. And you could, for example, have a look at Xing or LinkedIn, find out what other people have done with your degree before. There is such a variety of different positions and people end up in, yeah, in things they have maybe have not studied, but they like, and it is related because it's not maybe the same topic, but it's the skills they use that count for them.

00:29:23: Imke Hans: And at the same time, it also tells you that your degree itself is not the only thing that qualifies you for a position usually, but it is something where you have to gain additional skills. And that can be, as I said, through experience. It's also student jobs, it's your internship, so all of these things.

00:29:40: Imke Hans: But you can also take additional courses. There are so many options out there for free or paid to take software courses, for example, to take courses in, I don't know, online marketing was my last example. So you qualify yourself on the side, but in order to choose that, you need to find out where you want to go because there's no point in learning

00:30:01: Imke Hans: I don't know, SAP if you then want to become a Facebook community manager.

00:30:07: Stephan Hanf: And Facebook might disappear like MySpace and then you stand

00:30:10: Stephan Hanf: there, but it could happen. Yeah.

00:30:13: Imke Hans: That could also happen. Yeah.

00:30:14: Stephan Hanf: I think like the big issue with this topic is there isn't like a recipe for success and everyone is searching there.

00:30:20: Stephan Hanf: I still, I don't know what you actually can do except try to figure out what you're good at, what you like to do, but to resolve this issue to be employed for someone that you really don't like or the position you really don't like. I don't know if there really is a recipe.

00:30:37: Imke Hans: Networking is definitely another recipe, but I, the thing is, there can't be one recipe really.

00:30:44: Imke Hans: There can only be a certain amount of good advice, which is, you know, try to find out about yourself, get information on yourself. Get information about the job market. Try to be honest to yourself when it comes to who are you, what do you want to work for, what do you want to contribute to, but also try to be honest to yourself about what is actually success, because there can't be one recipe for success.

00:31:05: Imke Hans: It's the same as with careers. Some people do want a job and they want to finance, for example, their families, and they really don't care what they do. As long as it pays well, they're happily occupied with any task from morning to evening. They're fine with that. And there are other people who will be destroyed by working for an employer that they really don't like to work for and contributing to something that cannot stand behind.

00:31:32: Imke Hans: So the next person will say, success for me is if I can use my free time to do something, whether it's being creative or to contribute to something good. So I've met people who actually quit their well paid jobs, and they just have really very small jobs. They don't pay a lot just because they want to contribute to ecological projects in their free time.

00:31:53: Imke Hans: And for them, that's success because they've managed that. And then there's other people who prefer the model of linear careers. So they do want to get, I don't know, into one of these well-known, let's say one of the big four. And they want to raise in the ranks, they want to become a partner of a consultancy.

00:32:09: Imke Hans: So there are so many different models of career and success that I think it's difficult to give one recipe. But I think for all of them you need to look at yourself and gather information on yourself. Gather information of where you want to go. Be open. Don't follow set path. Just because they're out there for you, it might just not be the right one.

00:32:33: Imke Hans: And I think networking is also a very good aspect.

00:32:35: Stephan Hanf: Can you go into

00:32:36: Stephan Hanf: networking a little bit?

00:32:37: Imke Hans: I would say that the students being busy, for example, the student initiatives, they've already built a network. If you work, you have contacts and all of those people, they are your network basically. They could also be your neighbors, they're your parents' friends.

00:32:51: Imke Hans: You have a huge network. And for international students, they have to do more work to build a network within this country, obviously. But we all have certain networks. Some people are better at it. Some people are not as good because they don't like to communicate as much. But we do have a network and it can come through, I don't know, sports, events, clubs, anything.

00:33:11: Imke Hans: It doesn't have to be your family or anything. So. The contacts you have, they are a network. And I would say networking also means that you keep in touch with them. But there are other ways of keeping in touch and um, I would always recommend, for example, the business networks, it's not for everyone. So let's say you like the word of teaching or kindergarten, for example.

00:33:34: Imke Hans: There are not that many people out there in the business networks, but NGOs, initiatives, businesses, a lot of them are very active on either Zing or LinkedIn or both. You've worked with them before and you shouted out there that you now currently about to leave university and you're looking for an entry position.

00:33:55: Imke Hans: That can also help a lot because all of these contacts that have worked with you previously, they know about the quality of your work. So it should mean a lot if you've done a good job, obviously. But, so yeah, I think networking is a key to these things as well.

00:34:11: Stephan Hanf: So in

00:34:11: Stephan Hanf: my studies, I have a general idea of what kind of figure I want to go after my studies and then in advance look at what they actually want from me in the application, in the job offer, they give, ah, we, you need this and this.

00:34:23: Stephan Hanf: Language skills, I dunno, this software skills, would, that would've been a good idea to look at that before I finished my degree?

00:34:31: Imke Hans: Absolutely.

00:34:32: Stephan Hanf: Because I think most people don't do that.

00:34:33: Imke Hans: A lot of students do when they look for internships, they're already in contact with certain requirements. But that's what I'm, that's actually what I meant among other things about get information, you need to be informed.

00:34:44: Imke Hans: It's about information about the job market as well and the requirements that may be out there. So, If you're studying economics and finance and you think data science is a field that might be interesting for you, what kind of software do they need? What kind of programming skills might they need, and can you do that with an extra certification during the semester break to set yourself up so that the transition is a lot easier?

00:35:08: Imke Hans: And yeah, I think that's quite important. It's not about, and I'm not saying mold yourself entirely to the job market and just be what they need. I'm not saying that. So it's not about, I don't know, becoming putty in the hands of the job market. That's not the case. But it's about finding out what you want to do and then try to equip yourself for that.

00:35:28: Imke Hans: Because I mean, if I do want to, I don't know, organize events, but I realize that even throughout studies, I'm not good at email communication and I, I don't know. I can't handle all the emails I have. Well then imagine yourself in the situation of being an event organizer and there may be 70 bands involved, and that one event that you organize, how many emails do you think you're getting?

00:35:50: Imke Hans: So it's about setting yourself up now to actually be able to manage your email account and find out what are good regulations for me, how can I answer them? Are there any tools of making life easier? Learn them. You can do that during your studies. You can do that on the side. There are YouTube videos.

00:36:06: Imke Hans: There are so many different tutorials online. So yeah, it's about exactly that. What skills do I need to do what I want to do? And not in the sense of I need to do everything right so that they will hire me, but rather in the sense of, wow, this really helped me being good at what I want to do.

00:36:24: Stephan Hanf: And I think it's easier to get these skills during your studies then afterwards.

00:36:28: Stephan Hanf: Because now

00:36:29: Imke Hans: hell yeah.

00:36:30: Stephan Hanf: Because now you, at least as a student there, maybe that's something you can talk about what the possibilities are while you're a student. In contrast to when you're not a student anymore.

00:36:42: Imke Hans: If you're a student, you've got access to a whole world of things, and you usually have a student discount as well.

00:36:47: Imke Hans: So to give with one example, I'm always forwarding my students the courses of ERP for students. There are SIP courses online for students. They're non-profit. Now, that doesn't mean they're free, they still cost a lot of money, but it's nonprofit, so they don't gain anything from it, which in turn means if you're out there, you'll have access to profit courses and they will add a whole lot of more money.

00:37:11: Imke Hans: So it'll cost a lot more. So you have great access to these things. You can actually go for free into lectures that are relevant to the field you want to go to. There are so many options you have at this university or as a student in the city where you live in there will not come back again later that easily.

00:37:30: Imke Hans: On the other side, when you're done, you can sometimes under certain conditions get support from the government to take additional courses, but that doesn't apply to everyone. But yeah, so there are other options out there when you're done with your studies and you haven't found a job yet. However, I would make use of the chances right now.

00:37:51: Imke Hans: Definitely so many good options. But generally speaking, I would say that for example, we want to stay in this country. If you're not a German anyway and you want to stay in this country and you like the language skills, it may be worth taking a semester of block courses and actually learning the language.

00:38:09: Imke Hans: It is a lot easier than doing that, and it costs more money after your studies. So being enrolled as a student gives you a lot of opportunities, both in like generally physical opportunities as well as financial opportunities. As moving that to after your studies. And I think that the majority, if not all, employers don't really care if you took a semester longer.

00:38:37: Imke Hans: Hardly anyone cares if you spend that semester and it is well spent if you're part of the AStA, if you're taking additional courses, if you're learning the language. So all of these are things, time is not of as much of essence as the skills that you bring. And it's, as I said, everything is easier if you're not under pressure.

00:38:54: Imke Hans: If you're under pressure and you need to find a job and you need to finance yourself, you just don't have that many options anymore. You need a full-time job to, I don't know, pack parcels to earn your money. Well, how do you wanna learn language at the site? We already have a full-time job to finance yourself.

00:39:07: Imke Hans: Yeah, to answer your question, very simply put yes. As a student, it is so much easier and in many ways,

00:39:18: Stephan Hanf: Let's number two, have a

00:39:20: Stephan Hanf: voice.

00:39:20: Charlotte Winkler: Actually, I didn't want to come to Kleve because it was too tiny for me. So first I wanted to study law, and then I thought it could be too boring or too much. I was always interested in European studies and just learning languages, learning about new cultures. And then my study course was only offered in three German cities, and I didn't want to study abroad completely.

00:39:50: Charlotte Winkler: In Kleve, it was only taught in English. I decided to come here instead of taking one of the other opportunities because otherwise I would've done the study course in German and as I'm dealing with international relations, it makes more sense to study it in English as well. I made my goal to be able to work in the foreign ministry and with studying international relations, I still have a broad knowledge about economics, politics, but also law.

00:40:18: Charlotte Winkler: And funny enough, law modules are still my favorite. Maybe I still end up in the law section of international relations.

00:40:27: Stephan Hanf: So we wanted to meet someone from one of the university organizations that Imke Hans mentioned. So in last month's episode, we already met Charlotte Winkler, who was the AStA chair at the time of the recording, and we caught up with her again to find out more about AStA and what it is actually like to work in such an organization.

00:40:48: Charlotte Winkler: The first time I heard about the Asta was in my fresher's week, actually a chit-chatting event on campus. And that made me connect with my first real friends here and to know what the ASA actually does. I think that was when I got into the position of the chair, like speaking of what it all comprises, I knew basics, but I didn't know how much help we can give the students.

00:41:16: Charlotte Winkler: I knew that the AStA advocates the students' interests and that they do the events for finding friends, international or intercultural parties or whatever, but I didn't know how much they can help when you're in need despite loneliness. So that was sad too, because I feel like I should know more about my university or know more about my rights, and it's speaking in the perspective of the AStA chair,

00:41:47: Charlotte Winkler: it's especially sad because obviously we have all those mechanisms to help students, but they're not used because students don't know about them. Same goes for the student service and welcome center. So yeah, we are actually working on making our offers more public.

00:42:04: Stephan Hanf: And I think few people don't know that it's also a political position, the, AStA chair that you were involved with.

00:42:12: Stephan Hanf: So your position is you are voted into this position, right?

00:42:15: Charlotte Winkler: Basically, I would describe myself as the student's advocate, not only towards the university, but also to the towns. And sometimes that can be super challenging because obviously the town has different interests than students, right? So if you want to, let's say, make more offers like cultural offers for students who do not necessarily speak German, in a German town which wants to have the most visitors in one of their events, it's hard to actually go for, convince them to, to offer more English speaking events.

00:42:56: Charlotte Winkler: It's just one. One example, but it has a lot to do with mediating as well. Sometimes students don't understand decisions the university made, and it's just our task to explain it to them the best way possible. And even the war in Ukraine affects us because our university decided to help students of the Ukraine, or even basically everything politics related from outside of the university can affect the students within the university.

00:43:33: Charlotte Winkler: And just bringing that kind of together and be ready for changes is important. Especially the international department. They work so much with the Ausländerbehörde and visas and just trying to help people that they can stay here. And I think that's also a political act, I'd say. So, yeah, it has a lot to do with just trying to communicate with both sides and bringing them together.

00:44:03: Charlotte Winkler: And that's basically what I want to do in the future when I'm going to the foreign ministry. So it helped me a lot to just know about the soft and hard scales too.

00:44:13: Stephan Hanf: And this is like one place where you really have all the cultural issues and all the different backgrounds because people from all of the world are studying here.

00:44:24: Charlotte Winkler: Which is pretty nice.

00:44:25: Stephan Hanf: That's quite special. So I guess a lot of your work has to do to explain not only the good side of uh, German culture, but also like the bad side. German bureaucracy, for example. Do you ever had so much experience with German bureaucracy before you had to explain it to foreign students?

00:44:43: Charlotte Winkler: Not at all. I actually learned a lot about German bureaucracy while

00:44:48: Charlotte Winkler: having to deal with specific cases. I remember I've had a case with somebody from Russia and she accidentally made a contract with two health insurances, which is illegal in Germany. So that was interesting to deal with the health insurances and find out where she can stay now and who has to back down because obviously she can't be made responsible for that mistake, but rather the health insurances that allowed her to sign the second contract at least.

00:45:22: Charlotte Winkler: So that was interesting. But also, I've never really thought about choosing one because I've always been in the health insurance of my parents, for example, or opening a new bank account, applying for a job. There are a lot of other standards we learn in school about applying for a job then most internationals have, so that's also

00:45:46: Charlotte Winkler: nice that we have the student advisory service, or specifically the career service, at least in the Faculty of Society and Economics, that helps you with how to properly write an application to find a job. And that's something I, I took for granted as a German citizen, but, and never really thought about it beforehand.

00:46:06: Stephan Hanf: What

00:46:07: Stephan Hanf: actually can you do, not only moneywise, but what is like the main things, the assets offering? I know that's a lot, but maybe the most important things in your opinion.

00:46:17: Charlotte Winkler: I think one message I would like to put out there, because we love to chit chat as well and we love to give you tips regarding any problem I've already mentioned or for your exam, if you have issues, if you have failed and you're just very desperate and sad and we are there to, and we help you to find out whether you can have another try after you, you've failed more than once or

00:46:45: Charlotte Winkler: I don't know, like really ev anything. And we can also explain to you if you, for example, would like to get engaged in uni politics, we can help you and tell you how you can do it on a low, low level if it's too intimidating for you on a higher level.

00:47:03: Stephan Hanf: I remember when I was a student, I wasn't the student here, but that they were always quite desperate to get students to vote.

00:47:10: Charlotte Winkler: Oh yeah.

00:47:11: Stephan Hanf: There's also an issue here.

00:47:13: Charlotte Winkler: It is also an issue here.

00:47:15: Stephan Hanf: Why is it important

00:47:15: Stephan Hanf: to vote?

00:47:16: Charlotte Winkler: It's important to vote because right now, specifically at this University of Applied Sciences, there are only little people having a lot of power about what the university spends money on. What we do, what we try to advocate.

00:47:31: Charlotte Winkler: So if you vote and we have a more diverse teams of let's say, student parliament and F S R AStA, all the commissions, um, that decide upon money and evaluation of the university, we have broader ideas about what the whole student body wants. And not only, let's say the uh, three people that are engaged in student politics, really, because I know one of my friends, she's engaged in at least two commissions, the Senate and the AStA, and the FSR

00:48:07: Charlotte Winkler: so she has a lot of important positions and basically if she wanted to, she could just use it for her own interests really. And that's sad because she just took upon those positions because nobody else wanted to fill them. So yeah, I think that needs to change. That's why we need votes. And then again, at least I think it's going to improve again when we are more visible and we seem less intimidating when people actually start talking to us instead of just knowing the name AStA and Student Parliament.

00:48:41: Charlotte Winkler: But see that there are actually people behind it that are also unknowing students who sometimes don't know what they do and just try. And sometimes it works out, sometimes it doesn't. But that they see it's not just a job or a responsibility, but there's also fun behind it, a new community. And then you do it for fun in the first place.

00:49:04: Charlotte Winkler: And because you like to change something, change and you can actually change something. And I think if you don't know about it, you don't see the little changes we make, but just rather big changes that are like that take long, long time and maybe even like multiple terms. So it might seem unsatisfying to the outside, but if you're in it, it's just you still see you can do much, especially because our university is so young.

00:49:36: Charlotte Winkler: But that is a big advantage for us and that's also mirrored by the presidency or any person that works for the university, is that they're open to new ideas and that they really want to, not really want to make a change, that's the students, but are open to, to input, to help making that change. 'Cause sometimes they just don't know what we want and that's why you should vote so we can tell them what we want.

00:50:03: Stephan Hanf: What do you

00:50:03: Stephan Hanf: think is the biggest misconception people have when they want to be involved with the AStA?

00:50:08: Charlotte Winkler: I

00:50:08: Charlotte Winkler: think it's probably the thought that they're not qualified enough, that they think it's intimidating because they don't know how university politics run, but that's why you should join in one of those bodies, right?

00:50:23: Charlotte Winkler: To learn how it's run and to actually have a voice. I think that's just having little knowledge about how we can help and how to reach us, because I feel like a lot of students feel overwhelmed by the amount of aid our university offers, such as Welcome, center, student advisory service, us the FSRs, which are the student bodies from the faculties.

00:50:54: Charlotte Winkler: So I think they don't really know where to go to with their specific problem. And I've experienced that many students come to us and are already frustrated because they've went to at least two other institutions, uh, and they just handed them over. At least that's how they felt like. So what we try to do right now is also to sort the offers of help so students know directly where to go to best and don't feel like they have to contact at least three people before they can actually get help.

00:51:26: Charlotte Winkler: Because most of the time when they need help, it's urgent, so they don't have the time to go to three different places. And then I uh, explain their case over and over again if they're already having the courage to explain it at least once. So I think that's the main issue right now, especially let's say our loan, our loans we hand out for students that are in need of money, whether they just lost their job, they, they don't have the family support or anything really.

00:52:01: Charlotte Winkler: And it's qualified for if you need it, for either paying your health insurance, your semester contribution so that you're still able to actually study and are not blocked for a semester. And, and then for rent. So your basic needs, you can apply for when you need one of those three things. It actually goes through a long process, which is, it goes through the social committee of the student Parliament and the as a social department to decide whether you are suitable.

00:52:32: Charlotte Winkler: I mean, you have to show your bank transfers from the last three months, so we know whether you have a second account maybe, and try to fool us because we really don't want to pay out students and then that we don't have enough money for students that actually needed it. And then you have to repay us within the length of your studies, the form you can find on all our homepage there.

00:52:59: Charlotte Winkler: Or you can just go into our office either in Claven , the little red building or in KaLi, which is in building two. So yeah, you can just come up and ask and then we run through through the process with you. So yeah, there are opportunities for you to just get a little bit of relief regarding financial issues.

00:53:24: Stephan Hanf: And you should come probably before you are really in financial troubles or in dire straits,

00:53:31: Stephan Hanf: right?

00:53:31: Charlotte Winkler: You should come before you're really desperate because there is a process behind it and obviously they don't meet every day, but rather every two weeks. So yeah, it should be really not on the last call that you are asking for help, because otherwise we would love to help you. But in that short period of time, we might not be able to.

00:53:55: Charlotte Winkler: And if you are already in your last semester and we know that you're going to finish due to our financial order, we are also not able to. Give money to you because it's unrealistic that you're paying us back within your study time at the University of Applied Sciences.

00:54:17: Stephan Hanf: Lesson number three, as close as you can get to your studies. Jordan, thanks so much for the tour. Um, the first question is, what do you actually have to do after we finish this interview?

00:54:29: Jordan Freeman: What

00:54:29: Jordan Freeman: do I have to do? I will either ask somebody what, if they have anything they I they want me to do, or I'll go around the garden and I'll check my own.

00:54:38: Jordan Freeman: I, over there while we were talking, I saw some pathway being overgrown, so I'll probably take care of that. And then watering, we don't have to air gaze because it's been raining the last two days, but it's a lot of weeding and a lot of cutting down branches, plants. So not, not necessarily the pleasant part of

00:55:02: Jordan Freeman: working in a garden. I think you do this job not for the financial reward. Obviously you do to some extent. That is the base motivation for most people that would consider working here because I only did 20 hours in a month. So that comes out at minimum wage, about 200 euros plus minus. I don't know. So I think what the benefits you get from this job working here are besides, uh, a base income and 200 euros is certainly a lot of money for students, right?

00:55:41: Jordan Freeman: The benefits you get from this job is that you are as close as you can get to your studies. If you really enjoy agronomy right, then you are as close as it gets here. In this greenhouse. Right. So basically you get the benefits here, you're close to the professor, you're close to a lot of hands-on knowledge, a lot of experience, especially from Franz-Josef Kuhnigk, and professor Dr.

00:56:08: Jordan Freeman: Gebauer. I would not recommend to do this job for the money itself. No, I would not recommend that. So I will start working October 1st and in sales selling solar panels.

00:56:23: Stephan Hanf: Oh, really?

00:56:23: Jordan Freeman: Yeah. Oh. So for private rooftops, like gold rush right now. But I'll concentrate on doing it part-time. So I will, it's a, a great lecture ahead of me, I think, of learning about time management, of writing good grades and being successful at your job on the site.

00:56:49: Jordan Freeman: It comes down to time management, right? And I see a lot of students around here that think they don't have any time left, right? They mostly go to their classes and then maybe if they feel a little adventurous, they will do here and there, a little hour of studying during the semester and they think, wow, what have I done?

00:57:13: Jordan Freeman: But, and then they sit on their couch in the dorms for the rest of the day. You see it a lot. A lot of people are here in Kleve, are very comfortable, which is okay, we're students. But I know that for students with greater ambitions that come here to Kleve, this town is very nice because if you would study in Hamburg, you would have the ability to go partying 24/7, literally 24/7.

00:57:42: Jordan Freeman: That opportunity is not present in Kleve. Which I appreciate because you simply have to concentrate on your studies or at least something productive. And that is very nice about this town and this city. So to any future students that are listening, I would like to encourage them to come to this town with a, an open mind and give this town a real chance because I see it a lot.

00:58:14: Jordan Freeman: People come to Germany with these insanely high expectations that we all live in full bodied glass skyscrapers, and we all drive electric flying cars and everything is on time, and we have rules. And the rules are met. On the dot. That is not the case in Germany. That is, you will not find that in the university working with people from the university.

00:58:43: Jordan Freeman: You will not find that working with German authorities. You will find that a lot of Germans, they at least try to give their best, but at the end of the day, they're also just humans, right? And so a lot of people may be a little bit more setback on student issues, but I think a lot of the Germans are also very much engaged in helping international students of finding a new second home in Germany.

00:59:09: Jordan Freeman: So yeah, it's very important to come here with an open mind, give this town and the surrounding area a genuine chance to become a second home. Otherwise, I see a lot of people that are very unhappy here. You see it for sure, because they complain that it rains a lot and it's cold. But I guess you just have to force yourself in the first spring

00:59:31: Jordan Freeman: to not wear your winter jacket as an international student because Germans don't do that either. That is the very funny part though, that a lot, you know what I mean? Yeah. It's always very nice, but yeah. But it's amazing to study here. A lot of, so many different dishes you get to eat from your friends, right?

00:59:46: Jordan Freeman: All around the world. So many different culture, cultural experiences that you share. Very amazing.

00:59:54: Stephan Hanf: One question, you said that you'll have a different job. How in general, from your perspective, or of the perspective of your friends, how easy or hard is it to find a job doing

01:00:07: Stephan Hanf: your studies?

01:00:08: Jordan Freeman: They very much depends on your ability to speak German.

01:00:10: Jordan Freeman: If you can speak German, you will not have any issues whatsoever to find a job. So we're talking about a job, right? If you speak German, I promise you, you will find a job. If not, then you have not been looking well enough. Yeah, like some Edeka or Trinkgut or somebody will always need some 450 Euro worker always.

01:00:33: Jordan Freeman: Although some of those positions also require German, so I would definitely recommend learning German, but I think that's already a given. If you move to a country to go to school, basically free right of because the government of that country, the people of that country are paying for your education indirectly, then I think it's just already a thing out of respect to at least attempt to try to learn the language of that country.

01:00:58: Jordan Freeman: And I think that if you know the language of German, Germans will be a lot more friendlier, a lot. They can be more friendlier because you understand each other. Not every German, especially 50 years old and older does not everyone speaks English. If you do not speak German, then it might be a little harder.

01:01:19: Dr. Zunera Rana: I,

01:01:20: Dr. Zunera Rana: I, I said to myself, what do you mean there is no free lunch? And then as I studied more and more economics, I realized, yes, this, there is no free lunch. For

01:01:28: Dr. Zunera Rana: sure.

01:01:28: Stephan Hanf: Do you like the science field so much? Because at least you try to have a way to document the reality of things.

01:01:36: Dr. Zunera Rana: To understand the reality of things.

01:01:38: Dr. Zunera Rana: Yes. The economies that we have built up from, right from the scratch at home, we get a certain income and we divide that into different expenditures, into savings, into a secret account, whatever. Right. That's already economics. So we have economics in our own houses at that, in that sense. And then, How that is how we save more to maybe make an investment.

01:02:04: Dr. Zunera Rana: And that investment has a return, and that return is what you can use to buy a new TV or whatever. All of this on a micro level is already economics. And then when you move this further, it's really interesting to see that a factory closes in Kleve. I have nothing to do with Kleve, but because that factory closes, 5,000 people lose their jobs in the area.

01:02:28: Dr. Zunera Rana: And what do these 5,000 people do? They enter the job market again, which means me, who had nothing to do with this job, might find it hard to find a job now. These little links that exist in our everyday life from going to the bakery to coming to university. All of this is easily understandable because of economics, because there is some part of economics being played here and there over constantly.

01:02:53: Dr. Zunera Rana: So it's just easy to understand these things and the more you understand, the less angry you are to be honest.

01:03:11: Stephan Hanf: Thank you for listening to the How to Hochschule podcast. We hope you enjoyed the show, and feel free to follow us and recommend us to your friends. If you have any thoughts or suggestions or just want to let us know how you like the episode, please don't hesitate. Take courage and do reach out to us at podcast@hsrw.eu.

01:03:31: Stephan Hanf: We are always looking for ways to improve and we appreciate your feedback. Also, be sure to check out our show notes for links and more information on today's topics and guests next time on the How to Hochshcule podcast.

01:03:43: Hari: I'm the, I'm the host now. No longer just a, yeah. Co-host, I guess.

01:03:48: Stephan Hanf: Kinda. Yeah. Tune in next time as our student correspondent Hari is back with its very own episode.

01:03:55: Stephan Hanf: Thank you very much for joining us today. I'm Stephan Hanf. This is the How to Hochschule podcast. We are looking forward to have you back next time. Tschüß.