How to Hochschule VOICES - Christmas Special

How to Hochschule VOICES - Christmas Special

00:00:00: Stephan Hanf: As you can hear, we are back in the Mensa. My name is Stefan Hanf, I'm the producer of the How to Woosh for the Podcast and right next to me, no, left next to me to be honest, is,

00:00:37: Hariharan Arevalagam: I hope you recognize my voice, um, I'm Harry again, joining the podcast team for another fun little day out in HSRW. Yes,

00:00:46: hi,

00:00:47: Joost Kleuters: this is Joost from the Center for Internationalization of Languages.

00:00:49: Joost Kleuters: I'm also here. Yeah,

00:00:51: Stephan Hanf: we're back at the Mensa. We are here because it's a very special Christmas episode. As you can hear, it's buzzing around because we want to talk a little bit about Christmas and Christmas food. Today, the day of the recording is the 6th of December, which is in Germany and in the Netherlands.

00:01:07: Stephan Hanf: It's not really, in German, not really a holiday, but it's very famous for putting your boot in front of your door. And do you know about this tradition?

00:01:17: Hariharan Arevalagam: I guess they put presents in the

00:01:19: Stephan Hanf: boot? Yeah, that's right. So the Santa Claus comes in the night and put chocolate, mostly chocolate, or sometimes small gifts inside the boot.

00:01:29: Stephan Hanf: But in the Netherlands, it's a real holiday, I would say, right?

00:01:33: Joost Kleuters: It's not an official holiday, and it's not on December 6th. It's on December 5th. When Saint Nick, yeah, or Sinterklaas, which later became a Santa Claus in the U. S., comes and visits the kids and gives them presents.

00:01:47: Stephan Hanf: Does he come also at night?

00:01:49: Joost Kleuters: Yes, he's supposed to come at night. He arrives a little earlier, so a couple of weeks earlier, with his steamboat from Spain. In the Netherlands, December 5th comes first. Sinterklaas, Saint Nick's And only then are you allowed to get up a Christmas tree, or at least that's what it used to be. Now it's just, we do everything at the same time, more or less like in Germany.

00:02:07: Joost Kleuters: December 6th is the Nikolaus, but you also have your Christmas tree up, and it's just one big festive month. Like I have in the US with the Hanukkah and everything. You just put it all together. So, yeah, that's just the situation in the Netherlands.

00:02:21: Stephan Hanf: Now it's really interesting. What about the situation for you?

00:02:26: Hariharan Arevalagam: First of all, I'm a little bit mind blown by Santa Claus going to the Netherlands from Spain on a steamboat, because that to me is news. Because in the American shows, it's always like Santa Claus, this guy that lives on the North Pole, and he flies to wherever he's delivering presents to on a carriage, which is being pulled by reindeer, flying magical reindeer.

00:02:52: Hariharan Arevalagam: I don't know how international that image of it is, because Yeah, I've also heard people say that this, that version of Santa Claus, like an invention by Coca Cola or something like that. I'm not exactly sure. Yeah. It's, I

00:03:04: Stephan Hanf: think that's a rumor. It's because there are like pictures of him in green and then in red and white, but it's, I heard about that.

00:03:11: Stephan Hanf: I don't know how true that it is, but yeah, but now because in the Netherlands. He's like a bishop, right? That's what he's actually wearing. Yeah, I'm not too familiar with the whole

00:03:21: Joost Kleuters: history, but apparently he was from Turkey. He was a bishop who was from Turkey or working in Turkey. That's as much as I know.

00:03:29: Joost Kleuters: Yeah, I did Google though where, uh, Santa Claus is supposedly from. There's this town in Finland at least that has claimed it for itself. There is, I think there is a The whole Viennese in Finland,

00:03:40: Hariharan Arevalagam: I don't know. I think there's a guy there who actually dresses up as Santa Claus and you can actually go there to his house.

00:03:46: Hariharan Arevalagam: And it's a tourist attraction in Finland if I, if I understood correctly. But yeah, no, so obviously we have in Malaysia. No, I'll start with myself. For me, I don't really care about any festivities kind of thing. And in Malaysia, Christmas is more of a commercial kind of thing. Of course, there are Christians in Malaysia who celebrate Christmas in a more religious way.

00:04:06: Hariharan Arevalagam: They go to church and then they invite people to their houses. They put up the trees, they give gifts and stuff like that. And if you go to a Christmas party, like many companies have Christmas parties, and you go there and you do Secret Santa and stuff like that. So, like, they're really famous things, which I think everyone knows about.

00:04:20: Hariharan Arevalagam: But the sort of More regional types of traditions like what Joost just described in the Netherlands. I'm not really sure what happens in my country when it comes to that because I was never in the family celebrating Christmas. I was a guest at parties and stuff like that. But Being here in Germany. I love the Christmas markets.

00:04:40: Hariharan Arevalagam: I love the decorations. I love the fact that there's a holiday and The Christmas mood in itself is kind of it's kind of cool I guess it's also because I grew up as I said watching American TV and stuff like that So Christmas always seemed like a big deal even though To me there is no reason for it to be but yeah That's my Christmas experience.

00:05:02: Hariharan Arevalagam: So what do you do

00:05:02: Joost Kleuters: then in Malaysia for New Year's? Is that a big thing,

00:05:05: Hariharan Arevalagam: or? Yeah, so it really depends. So when I was younger, you know, I would just stay home with the family. When I was really young, there used to be a big party at my house every year. So we'd have relatives coming from other parts of the country, and then we'd have a barbecue, and then people start dancing and partying and stuff like that, all in the house.

00:05:24: Hariharan Arevalagam: As I got a little bit older, all these people started getting older, and this didn't happen so often. New Year's in Malaysia, there would be public, like, street parties and stuff like that. So, there would be DJs out in public and the whole streets partying. So, that would be what happens in New Year. Or just stay home and do something with the family.

00:05:43: Hariharan Arevalagam: But, I would, yeah, if I had to choose, obviously, the street parties.

00:05:47: Stephan Hanf: I think I have to talk about the German version of it. So, I think It depends a little bit where in Germany because Germany has different Christmas traditions. So like the whole St. Nicholas I wouldn't say a big deal, but it's a deal at least for small children I think maybe the same in the Netherlands, but you don't have the Knecht Ruprecht Trumpets stuff.

00:06:08: Stephan Hanf: You don't have that, right? That his helper is not like the bad guy, but he's the one who punished the children who were, uh, bad? You have something like this? It's the same thing. Oh, it's, it's Yeah. Oh. Okay, but they, but, but They carry wooden

00:06:20: Joost Kleuters: sticks to hit the kids with.

00:06:21: Stephan Hanf: Oh, yeah, okay, it's the same thing, yeah.

00:06:23: Stephan Hanf: Because if you go more in, in the south of Germany, they are like demons. Krampus. Yeah. Krampus. Yeah, but they don't exist in this region, it's But is, is it, is it, is it like

00:06:33: Hariharan Arevalagam: a different helper? No, I guess

00:06:35: Joost Kleuters: it's the same thing, but like I said, it's Way less focus on that than it was before because in the Netherlands it really stands in a truly racial Racist tradition, right?

00:06:45: Joost Kleuters: It's been very good to move away from that rebranded. So there's less focus on the racist part of it. That was definitely there in the past. It's less focused on punishing the kids, hitting kids, kidnapping them back through Spain, right? All kinds of things like that. Yep. It was the right thing to do, to move on from those aspects of the whole

00:07:03: Stephan Hanf: thing.

00:07:04: Stephan Hanf: Yeah. And they get coal. They don't get presents. It's the same

00:07:07: Joost Kleuters: thing. They get coal. That is something German. That I never heard

00:07:09: Hariharan Arevalagam: about. Yeah. I've also heard about that in the, like I said, in the American shows I grew up watching. If you're a good kid, if you're nice, you get gifts, if you're naughty, then you get coal.

00:07:21: Hariharan Arevalagam: Yeah.

00:07:21: Stephan Hanf: That's a, I think that's a German thing, but I'm not quite sure because the problem is that all these things. They're intermixed now, right? They're not like, with Christmas. Because in German it used to be the Christkind. Which is a really strange. Baby Jesus. Yeah, it's yeah, it's really strange because it's always.

00:07:39: Stephan Hanf: It's the same thing in the U. S.

00:07:39: Joost Kleuters: It's just baby Jesus. It's disgusting. Yes,

00:07:42: Stephan Hanf: but it's really

00:07:42: Joost Kleuters: strange because. He brings the gifts, right? It's also weird like a baby bringing gifts. Yeah. It's even weirder than an old guy on a horse on the road.

00:07:49: Stephan Hanf: Yes, but it's not really like a baby because the German version is like it looks like an angel in white with blonde hair and locks.

00:07:56: Stephan Hanf: That's creepy. And always played by a girl actually like in Yes, so it's really strange. But still, in Germany you still have the Krippenspiel and stuff like that. You don't really have that in the Netherlands, right? Where you build up like the stall where Jesus was born with the Heiligen Drei Könige, the three kings and stuff like that.

00:08:15: Stephan Hanf: Yeah, that's a thing in Germany. At least In church then? Yeah, and also in some homes. You see it on the Christmas trees. But Christmas trees are also like a German thing.

00:08:24: Joost Kleuters: It used to be in Germany. Some people would have that as well.

00:08:28: Stephan Hanf: But I don't think, yeah, but in Indonesia, nobody really.

00:08:32: Hariharan Arevalagam: Yeah, you have Christmas trees, but the fake ones, the plastic trees.

00:08:35: Hariharan Arevalagam: Oh, alright. I have one at home as well, because at some point, just for the aesthetic, we started putting up a Christmas tree, and it's plastic, so you use the same one every year. We don't have the climate to naturally grow those kind of trees, obviously. Yeah. So we have the plastic Christmas tree, and then we just decorate it however, as I said.

00:08:51: Hariharan Arevalagam: It's become like a holiday for everyone just to get in on it because it's so maybe commercialized. It is. I'd say. But, this thing, we talk about Krampus. So, in the South and in Austria, it's this really scary looking demon thing. But you mentioned something like over here, there's someone who beats the kids as

00:09:06: Stephan Hanf: well.

00:09:06: Stephan Hanf: What is, who is that? Knecht Huprecht.

00:09:09: Hariharan Arevalagam: Knecht Huprecht. Huprecht.

00:09:11: Stephan Hanf: Huprecht. Yeah, Knecht, it's Helper? Or No, it's not a helper. Servant. Servant. Yeah, servant. So Rupert the servant? Yeah. Something like this. Yeah. And he's dressed on all black Uhhuh. And he got like a black beard Uhhuh. He's like the black ver black enclothed, right?

00:09:25: Hariharan Arevalagam: Black bird. Anti Santa Claus? A little bit. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Okay. Okay. Because, uh,

00:09:29: Stephan Hanf: and he beats, he doesn't kidnap them, but he beats them up so they .

00:09:33: Hariharan Arevalagam: So I've seen images of the. Campus in Austria, and he's actually scary like they're not trying to make it like Funny or cute or something. It's actually scary And I've heard that what he kidnaps kids and sometimes they really they really invested in the act of doing it Isn't that like really traumatizing for

00:09:51: Stephan Hanf: children?

00:09:52: Stephan Hanf: Yeah, I think so. I don't know. I think it's a little bit overblown what it's actually is. I think only certain spots do that and it's like a festive atmosphere. But I think it's like Halloween, you know, it's part of being scared. It's like the fun, fun stuff. Because kids up to a

00:10:07: Hariharan Arevalagam: certain age usually think Santa Claus is real, right?

00:10:09: Hariharan Arevalagam: Yeah. So they probably think Krampus is real as well. And that's probably really scary.

00:10:12: Stephan Hanf: Yeah, probably. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. It's, but I can't really say anything about this tradition. But, but I can say something about, it's about Christmas food. Because we're here for a certain reason, we have to taste something.

00:10:24: Stephan Hanf: Someone told me, I won't say who it was. Someone told me that on St. Nicholas you can eat goose here. Christmas goose. Which is, at least in my family, a big thing. Like on Christmas, something festive and there's different versions of what you eat. But is there like special food meat or non meat or

00:10:44: Joost Kleuters: No. No, Dutch people are very sensitive to what's fashionable and so they do everything, they do something new every year depending on whatever it is they think is fashionable to do for that year.

00:10:56: Joost Kleuters: So sometimes it's all vegetarian, the other year you get like a very big turkey for Christmas, whatever. So it changes a lot. So there's some But it's always supposed to be festive and a little bit A little bit over the top and more than you would otherwise do. So just the effort, it really counts when it comes to Christmas food in the

00:11:15: Stephan Hanf: Netherlands.

00:11:16: Stephan Hanf: So maybe this year try Würstchen mit

00:11:19: Hariharan Arevalagam: Kartoffelsalat. Yeah, I don't care. I wouldn't

00:11:20: Stephan Hanf: mind, sure. But what about, is there a special Christmas food? I think they don't really celebrate Christmas. Rice. We're back

00:11:26: Joost Kleuters: with the rice. We're back

00:11:27: Hariharan Arevalagam: with rice. Christmas rice. Christmas rice pudding. Okay, I can't speak for every Malaysian here, but usually, when I would go to some kind of party, for some kind of festivity, So, if it's Diwali, or Deepavali, it's traditional, like, Indian food, family cook, something like that.

00:11:46: Hariharan Arevalagam: If it's, uh, Chinese New Year, you have, uh, different types of food. But when it's Christmas, there's no fixed thing. So, if I go to, like, an office party or something like that, I eat pizza. Pizza is a very popular party food in Malaysia. You have party with people, you get pizza.

00:12:05: Joost Kleuters: It's universal, I would say.

00:12:06: Stephan Hanf: Yeah. Yeah. What I heard once from, uh A student from Japan, at Christmas they eat KFC. Hell yeah. Yeah. It's a chicken. Chicken. I don't know why, actually. But he, probably because they put out a commercial. Because in Japan they also don't really celebrate Christmas. They like all the western commercial stuff with the tree, of course.

00:12:28: Stephan Hanf: But for some reason KFC is like a tradition there. They have like special menus during Christmas. We should go there.

00:12:35: Hariharan Arevalagam: I should actually ask, I should ask one of my Christian Malaysian friends how they actually celebrate Christmas, because I never thought

00:12:43: Stephan Hanf: about it. One thing that's very typical for Christmas or the December season, and the reason why we're actually here, is chocolate.

00:12:51: Stephan Hanf: So you're able in the Mensa Here in Klevel and probably also in Kamp Blimpford, I'm quite sure, you can buy chocolate from a certain company. I won't name the name of the company. It arrives with wind. Um, someone told me it's a good deal. If it's, it's not that cheap, but it wasn't, it was in price range of chocolate.

00:13:12: Stephan Hanf: It was all right. It wasn't like the best deal ever, but it was an all right deal. So

00:13:16: Hariharan Arevalagam: real quick, uh, this brand, which we're not going to name, yes, in my country, it's It's

00:13:20: Stephan Hanf: really expensive. It is expensive. It's one of the most expensive.

00:13:23: Hariharan Arevalagam: Yeah. Yeah. But over here it's like much more like affordable. It is. So who wants to

00:13:27: Stephan Hanf: open up?

00:13:27: Stephan Hanf: So what we do, you now, dear listeners, is service. We've been looking at this for 45 minutes. Yes. We do you a serve. We want to taste it. And we, uh, because we don't name the brand name, we, we, we will be honest if we find it good or bad. So these are.

00:13:44: Joost Kleuters: There are only four little beers, which is disappointing.

00:13:47: Joost Kleuters: We're doing a sort of box opening

00:13:49: Stephan Hanf: or what do you call it? It's, yeah, unboxing. Unboxing without the video, just like the audio version. Yeah, it's four little beers, and it's, I don't know, what is it? Choco Spekulatius? But how is the chocolate? Be honest. Good, good,

00:14:04: Joost Kleuters: nice. Tastes good,

00:14:06: Hariharan Arevalagam: milk chocolate.

00:14:07: Stephan Hanf: Do you think it's a good So, I think that the special thing, because this is something you probably can get in every shop, but the special thing is what is in the clear bag.

00:14:16: Stephan Hanf: So, I think this is something that's from the factory, actually. And what was more or less, I think the German name would be Bruchschokolade. I don't know really what's the English name for that. Can you say that again? Bruch? Bruch, break chocolate. I think it's from the, from the Industry floor, it wasn't repackaged or something like that.

00:14:38: Stephan Hanf: So I think this is, this is the good deal. So we, yeah, I don't know, what, have you tasted something already? How is it? You can be honest, because we didn't name the company name. Is there marzipan in this? No, that's Spekulatius. It's, it's German, I don't know, it's probably also in the Netherlands, like Spekulatius.

00:14:55: Stephan Hanf: Yeah, so it's a kind of cookie, a special cookie.

00:14:58: Hariharan Arevalagam: Ever since I came to Germany, every winter, I eat Spekulatius. So, when I first got here, I tried it, I fell in love with it. So, I always

00:15:06: Stephan Hanf: look forward. Yeah, there are two different versions. Oh, there are different versions in general. Okay, okay.

00:15:11: Hariharan Arevalagam: Yeah. But this cinnamony, star anise kind of.

00:15:15: Hariharan Arevalagam: Yeah, that one. I look forward to it every year. I absolutely love it. But this one tastes more like marzipan, honestly. But it's not. I

00:15:25: Stephan Hanf: don't know. No.

00:15:28: Hariharan Arevalagam: Maybe a hint of it, because I really don't like marzipan. Ah, alright. But I love speculatius.

00:15:33: Stephan Hanf: Good to know. 7 out of 10. Well, taste, taste, uh, uh, beer, uh, beer? It's a beer, right?

00:15:38: Stephan Hanf: Beer, beer, beer, yeah. Beer is like what you drink.

00:15:42: Hariharan Arevalagam: Also, I really love the The, for Easter and for Christmas, you have these chocolates from the famous, the big chocolate brands shaped either like Santa or the Easter bunny, and then it's unwrapped, and then inside it's hollow, but it's just, and I love those as well.

00:15:58: Hariharan Arevalagam: I also look forward to those a lot. So yeah, in Germany for these festivities, I look forward to their special chocolate that comes out, and then I just binge.

00:16:07: Stephan Hanf: So how's your judgment so far? If you taste one, Yeah, so in

00:16:10: Joost Kleuters: these small cubes, that's filled with, this is filled with almonds. Ah. With, what do you call them?

00:16:16: Joost Kleuters: Almonds we add with sugar, it has a special name. What do you call it? Marzipan. Yeah. Thank you. Oh,

00:16:21: Stephan Hanf: okay. Something that you also

00:16:22: Hariharan Arevalagam: really like. But I'm going to eat it anyway, just to be sure.

00:16:24: Joost Kleuters: And the one you just had with the spiculatius, that's not, I don't know, that's a 5 out of 10. Because the combination, spiculatius, that's cookies.

00:16:33: Joost Kleuters: And why would you mix that with, I don't know. So this

00:16:36: Hariharan Arevalagam: is not my. The bear though. The bear is really good. But there are only

00:16:41: Stephan Hanf: four of them in there. The thing is, when you think about this company, and this chocolate, you really don't think about, at least in my mind, it's just the chocolate, because that's what it's known for.

00:16:54: Stephan Hanf: Not like the chocolate mixed with cinnamon, or with, there's one brand of the, this chocolate, Follmi Schokolade. I think so, maybe I'm completely wrong, because I'm not that much into chocolate anyways, but. No, I've always

00:17:05: Hariharan Arevalagam: seen, like, this chocolate. with many different flavors, um, and some of them get weird, like orange.

00:17:13: Hariharan Arevalagam: Yes. I've even seen chili. Yeah. Which I've never tried. Yeah. I don't know, this seems like the most normal thing, considering

00:17:20: Stephan Hanf: the stuff they've done. Yeah. Maybe one thing, because we're in Cleve right now, I have to say, so there are local businesses who actually produce their own chocolate here. I also won't name the businesses, but there are, at least I feel, I know two, maybe there are more.

00:17:33: Stephan Hanf: So there's one in the .

00:17:35: Joost Kleuters: Yeah. That's what you got say one. Yeah. Yeah. I don't know where the other one is.

00:17:39: Stephan Hanf: Yeah, I dunno. Would you say it's, it's a good deal so far, like for our listeners, should they. Invest almost, I think it's 10 Euros, almost 10 Euros, I don't know exactly, for this

00:17:50: Joost Kleuters: package right now. It's 700 grams of chocolate, assorted chocolate, marzipan.

00:17:57: Joost Kleuters: Was it 10 Euros? I

00:17:58: Stephan Hanf: think it was 10 Euros, I don't, yeah. That's a little expensive.

00:18:02: Hariharan Arevalagam: If they can

00:18:02: Stephan Hanf: find one. it's like, I don't know.

00:18:05: Hariharan Arevalagam: If they could find one that had more of these, because they have, there are three types of chocolate here, but the best type is just four pieces. So if they could find a company, or a type of chocolate, that had, if they're going to be assorted, at least more evenly distributed, then it makes sense.

00:18:21: Stephan Hanf: I think that's probably not possible because they just pack it. In what is the leftovers, more or less. I think that's how it works. Ah. Because you can only buy it in the Mensa. I've never seen it anywhere before except the Mensa. So I think it's a special thing for, they did for, for the Mensa. I think so.

00:18:37: Stephan Hanf: Because you also don't get like a student discount on that. Okay. Yeah.

00:18:41: Hariharan Arevalagam: It's worth giving it a shot if it's a once a year kind of thing. Worth the experience, right?

00:18:46: Stephan Hanf: Yeah, I think the company is like a luxury brand of chocolate. That's, I think that's safe to say. And, but there's also a funny anecdote about the company.

00:18:53: Stephan Hanf: I won't name, but one of the founders of them, because the first time I heard this anecdote, I thought, ah, that sounds not true. But someone told me, oh no, it was like almost 200 years ago, 150 years ago, whatever. So he used to be a big ladies man, right? He has like a smaller chocolate factory and he had a date on Friday and he forget because he was more interested in the date than in producing chocolate.

00:19:14: Stephan Hanf: He was more interested in the date so he forget to power down the factory, the chocolate making factory. So the chocolate producing machines run the whole weekend. And he came back and said, oh no, what did I do? But I guess he had a nice weekend but still he come back on Monday. And he tasted the chocolate and he realized,

00:19:33: Joost Kleuters: oh, it tastes really

00:19:34: Stephan Hanf: nice and really better.

00:19:36: Stephan Hanf: And he discovered by accident, uh, process where the chocolate gets more smooth. It's like the really general way to say it. And that's what this company became famous for, but now everyone is doing it because it's not like a big secret. But he discovered it by accident. So the longer chocolate is heated, the better the taste is,

00:19:56: Hariharan Arevalagam: more or less.

00:19:56: Hariharan Arevalagam: Okay. Wow. There's another type of chocolate that we missed in this bag. It's not exactly a cube. It's very regular shape.

00:20:05: Stephan Hanf: And there you can see it's like a This one looks like India. Yeah, that's actually true.

00:20:09: Hariharan Arevalagam: And it has nuts in it. Yeah, and

00:20:11: Stephan Hanf: there you can see that it's probably from the factory floor, because it doesn't look like the way

00:20:15: Hariharan Arevalagam: you package anything.

00:20:17: Hariharan Arevalagam: This was not intentional.

00:20:18: Stephan Hanf: Yes, so that's like the last thing we're going to taste today. I got the

00:20:21: Hariharan Arevalagam: UK. Oh yeah, you got the UK. Yeah,

00:20:24: Stephan Hanf: but that could be Portugal actually. Looks like it. Okay, that's like the last thing and then final judgment. I will be, because I think I'm the host, I will be neutral. So you can do your final judgment.

00:20:38: Stephan Hanf: Worth it or not worth it?

00:20:40: Joost Kleuters: If you have not already been buying your Christmas chocolates, you can't go wrong with this one.

00:20:45: Stephan Hanf: Alright, that's a soft recommendation. How about you?

00:20:50: Hariharan Arevalagam: I love chocolate, but I'm also very picky with my chocolate. So I wouldn't recommend it. I would recommend something else, honestly.

00:20:58: Hariharan Arevalagam: Yeah, there's just too much going on, I feel. With these chocolates. There are too many different flavors. It's way too sweet. I generally prefer darker chocolates myself. Oh yeah. I personally wouldn't buy this for myself, but I would buy something else. And I'm planning to actually go check out the other options after we're done here.

00:21:16: Hariharan Arevalagam: But yeah, it depends on your taste in the end. If you have a sweet tooth, this probably would be good. Because it's really sweet.

00:21:21: Stephan Hanf: Yeah, I think I would agree. I think it's a good gift. Because the brand is really well known and, uh, and it's, I think it's a Yeah,

00:21:29: Joost Kleuters: but this is German words, right? Just because it's this brand that is cost more than the others Yeah, I know.

00:21:35: Joost Kleuters: doesn't necessarily mean it's better. So it is a great, long German word, the Qualitätsvermutungseffekt. I love that one.

00:21:58: Stephan Hanf: Thank you for listening to the household podcast. We hope you enjoyed the show and feel free to follow us and recommend us to your friends. We are always looking for ways to improve and we appreciate your feedback. Take courage and do reach out to us at podcast at hsrw. edu. Also, be sure to check out our show notes.

00:22:16: Stephan Hanf: links and more information on today's topics and guests. We are looking forward to hear you next time. Tschüss!